I WAS A PIONERITA, I LEFT CUBA ON 1980 BY MARIEL, AND I AM 100% WITH YOU ABOUT THE EMBARGO.
YAMY CHOY

I wonder how much she originally purchased those paintings for that she resold for $3000?

One might call that exploitation...

She probably got them for a song Scott. 20, 30 bucks.

And it's not just people like her, but las mulas, the ones that travel to the island frequently as mules. For a fee, of course.

There is alot of this going on. The money for relatives is but a drop in the bucket of money that goes to the island.

Hi, I do not support the embargo
We should do away with it as soon as possible. The only thing it helps is make everything more expensive, and lines the pockets of not only Castro but all his partners here in the yuma.
without the embargo, you could
Mail US mail at standard prices
UPS at standard prices
Import or export at standard prices
travel to or from the island at standard prices
make phone calls at standard prices
And many more that I can't think of right now

The embargo KEEPS Castro in power, it give him control
of the people and Ideas. As long as the embargo stands Cuba will remain a third would country. But look on the bright side, Miami was a cow pasture before the revolution
And now we get cheep lawn care.

Madtom

Damn, Val, you lay it out as heartbreakingly plain as day, you describe a knife in the heart, and then along comes someone like Madtom . . .

Standard prices.

When Madtom gets his head out of that dark, tight, stinky place, he might want to peruse Ben Corbett's book This is Cuba. On page 246 he interviews Luis, who has just won the lottery visa.

"Luis, why is it important to you to move to the United States?" I asked.

"How much does a new television set cost in your country, for example, similar to this one here?" he asked me, pointing to Armando's nineteen-inch diagonal set.

"About $150," I said.

"In Cuba, a new television lke this costs $350, not in pesos, in divisa . . . "

What can you do except keep trying to get the truth out there?

JdB

About $150," I said.

"In Cuba, a new television lke this costs $350, not in pesos, in divisa . . . "

What can you do except keep trying to get the truth out there?

JdB

Thank you sir for making just my point, That is exactly what I was talking about. $350-$150= $200 embargo tax on the common guy. You think it makes a difference to the regime? Ask Armando, see what he thinks.

Madtom

Madtom,

The average doctor in Cuba makes $20. Where the hell do you think the money for a $350 TV is going to come from?

Stop staring at bark and admire the forest.

The average doctor in Cuba makes $20. Where the hell do you think the money for a $350 TV is going to come from?

Stop staring at bark and admire the forest.

Val Prieto

Again I understand exactly what you are saying, but this is because of the regime, and the regime is helped by the embargo. Remove the embargo and the regime will fall. Look around even Venezuela where there is a Castro Jr. but the people are strong and have access to free markets. they fight for their freedoms every day. Do you think an embargo on Venezuelan would help or hurt the hand of chaves?

My guess is that it would kill the resistance and they would spiral down to the pits of doom.

Madtom

"Remove the embargo and the regime will fall"

Naive.

Castro is a piece of shit--no doubt about it. However, Tom is right on this issue. No other country supports a trade embargo on Cuba, not because they think Castro is a great leader of an island paradise, but because it isolates the countries economy and artificially fucks with all all of the prices. You are right for not supporting Castro, but the link between him being an asshole and a trade embargo is a bit weak. Saying "Remove the embargo and the regime will fall" is naive to say the least. But it is safe to say that by removing the embargo the average Cuban would have a little bit better standard of living. And after all, in the case of Cuba it is the people that are getting fucked the worst. It isn't fair that they suffer even more just so the US can try to teach Castro a lesson. Val, you're obviously Cuban, and SOME people in this blog are obviously concerned about civil rights, but don't be blinded by your hatred for one man-- even if that man IS one of the most horrible human beings on the planet.

one additional comment:
Sending money to Cuba IS like fighting cancer with aspirin. You are 100% correct. However, it doesn't make the disease spread. The Castro regime is about as horrible and powerful as it will get. no doubt Castro will be seeing more money, but again; so will the people. Castro is already rich, but the Cuban people are not. Lifting the embargo won't make them rich but will at least give them a bit more money. Noone can dispute that the Cuban people were as poor as they are now before the embargo was put in place. Cuba has a lot to offer to the world economy. It won't be long before Castro is burning in hell for all eternity, and Cuba will be free. For now, the people should at least be earning something closer to a liveable wage.

I know Im in for some liberal lecturing when I read something that begins:

Castro is a piece of shit--no doubt about it. However...

Every other country in the world does business with Cuba. Yet Cubans are still dirt poor and lacking in basic necessities. Is that the fault of the embargo? Hardly. Its the result of an ideologyand one man's fight to maintain it and power to wield it.

You know what wpould happen if American interests were allowed to, say, open a hotel in Cuba? castro would lease them the land at exhorbitant prices, he would then allow Cubans to work in building and maintaining the hotel, charging the hotel owners for the labor while paying these workers a trifling wage.

For now, the people should at least be earning something closer to a liveable wage.

this, under the present system of government in Cuba, is impossible.

Justin, you seem like an intelligent person, but you just cant judge Cuba by our standards. She refuses to be judged.

Oh, and that American hotel I mentioned, after building it, preparing it and then cleaning up after all the tourists, these working Cubans would not be allowed to enter, much less stay a night in it.

That's certainly not the fault of the embargo now is it?

I understand how your hotel example would work. I am not saying the embargo is solely to blame for Cubans being dirt poor. I am saying it makes things worse by artificially screwing up prices.

I am good friends with a Cuban-American whose uncle works in a tourist hotel. He was paid $40 US a month and that was considered an incredible salary- it was enough that he sent money to his immediate and extended family. This is ridiculous. The money is clearly going to Castro.

I am not here to argue that Castro is a great leader. He has some great ideas that he preaches to those who are willing to listen, but these are merely ideas. He has an impressive following of idiots posing to be leftists. You obviously know this. I know lifting the embargo would not cause the 'the regime to fall', as madtom said. It's a nice thought, but we both know things are a bit more complicated than that.

I understand your hatred for Castro. By what I've seen in this blog you have a lot more reason to hate him than I do. Lifting the embargo would in many ways make Castro appear the victor, but if the people are even slightly better off, isn't it worth it? Right now he uses the embargo as an excuse for his country being poor. Obviously if it were lifted the US would be Cuba's main trading partner (seeing as how the US is both nearby and rich), and with increased trade a lot more money would be coming into Cuba. Lots of it would go to Castro, but SOME would go to the people.

By lifting the embargo Castro would get a lot more pressure to perform. He would no longer have the embargo crutch to lean on as he has been for decades. Exports like Sugar, tobacco and nickel would increase so much that he would be forced to start showing some infrastructure in the country. He's a dick, but he sure knows how to kiss ass to the UN. He would need to do something to stay in their good books, don't you think?

I understand that Cuba is a special case. It can't be compared to our country, or any country for that matter. It is especially different from it's Latin American neighbours. All I am saying is that it is underachieving right now, and it's not because of the people. It is partly to do with the embargo and mostly to do with a ruthless asshole.

Help me out here: "Maria" bought two paintings for a song, sold them to a guy on South Beach for three grand a pop, and Val's using this as an example of adding money to Castro's coffers, which is why he doesn't support the embargo?

It seems like a Chinese-style incremental move towards free trade in which Castro was given a sizable (but not near-total) chunk of any transaction would be possible to negotiate with the Bearded Demon, allowing the Cuban artist to deal directly with the Guy on South Beach, and perhaps walk away with 25% of the transaction instead of the 1% described above.

One thing is clear: the embargo makes Maria's business model possible, and ending it would force her to move on to the next nefarious scheme. It's telling that she doesn't "make much money here" in the US - we have a legitimate free market (more or less) in which she can't operate. I suspect that a free or freer market in Cuba would probably enrich Castro somewhat but also go a long way towards eliminating "Marias" on both sides of the strait.

I never said that removing the embargo was a silver bullet. But it is for sure 100 times more naive to think that what the embargo has not delivered in 40+ years, we will get from leaving up for a few more.
I like the hotel example, for one, the people I know tell me that the back door of a hotel is the best bodega in town. Many people eat dinner from just the leftovers.
If there was no embargo, we could send in the spring breakers. This would mean that the regime would have to spend a lot of security resources on protecting and watching the tourist. This would give the resistance more room to maneuver. If the police are busy over there we can act over here.
I hope that noone out there got the idea from my post that I am a Castro supporter. I am not, never have been, never will be.
I support a free and democratic Cuba.

Madtom

Val: after reading all this I see the biggest flaw in all this "logic" that is being tossed about. The simple fact is that ONLY the U.S. is involved in the embargo....the rest of the world can trade with Cuba and the system there has still failed.(Sooo who's fault is that?) Having a rich near neighbor willing to spend money won't change anything, it hasn't so far, with repect to say Canada, or the E.U. or U.S.S.R before that. Most of the comments I have read here are founded not on a lack of understanding of the situation, but a deliberate mis-representation of the facts. The other problem not mentioned is that "Fidelito"/sarcasm/ is not alone...he is supported inside and outside Cuba.

Bill,

I understand the embargo just fine, thanks. If people knew for sure that there was one 'correct' solution they would do it. We don't know, and that's what makes this a matter of personal opinion.

Justin: I will tell you what my father told me when I was ten; "You will know when I am speaking to you...I will use your name."
I am quite sure you "understand" the embargo but, you continue to ignore and deny the underlying truth....Fidelito has FAILED to produce as an administrator, (try voting him out of office). He has had ample opportunities to make his "experiment" succeed and has not. That is his and their, (those that support him), failure, not ours. That is one of the great things about living in an open society, I can follow my conscience and do what I know to be right. I can support whomever I choose. The truth is that you do know what the "correct" solution is...if you were in doubt , why do you adopt the tone that you do?
Let me finish by saying that my problems are mine, not yours and ultimately I resolve them not you. I am responsible for my failures and my successes, not you.
Fidelito wants it both ways, if he fails it is someone elses fault, if he succeeds,he did it by himself.

I am quite sure you "understand" the embargo but, you continue to ignore and deny the underlying truth....Fidelito has FAILED to produce as an administrator, (try voting him out of office). He has had ample opportunities to make his "experiment" succeed and has not. That is his and their, (those that support him), failure, not ours

I KNOW

for some reason it seems you think I am sympathetic to castro's regime. I assure you I am not. I am not even sure how to respond to this because it seems we agree (more or less).

the only thing we don't agree on is that the embargo has added to the hurt Cuba has felt. I don't need to restate my argument, however I am quite sure of this. You can have your opinion as well because frankly it's all in the past and the question will never be answered with finality. Having said this, I still think you are wrong. And I am not just saying this because I feel like it. From the facts that is the conclusion I have come to. If I didn't know what I was talking about I would never have posted a comment to begin with.

The world is a big place ...with markets for products everywhere. Large markets, small markets and those in between. Common sense tells me that if the big markets are not open to me, I move on from market to market until I find one open to me. I don't demand that the big market open for me, unless I have something that is indespensable. This has been the continueing problem....Fidelito wants trade with the U.S. for various reasons and believes that normalization is a possibility, as well as, a probability of that actually occurring.
Do I believe this to be an added burden to the Cuban public? Certainly. But, ultimately they are the only ones that have any chance at making any significant form of change.

That's kind of what I was saying. I just don't think the embargo facilitates change.