Whereas I feel like this. Which is pretty damned close.

Yeah, that pretty well sums it up for me too.

Right there with you guys...

IT IS TIME TO KICK ASS, TAKE NAMES, AND TO HELL WITH COLLATERAL DAMAGE.

LETS SHOW THE WORLD WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU REALLY PISS US OFF!!!!!!

I am over these damn fools...and I do mean over them completely...They want to meet Allah? Well BRING IT ON BIG BOYS...I'LL PUNCH THEIR DAMN TICKET ANY DAY.

That's exactly what they want us to feel. They want a wider war with lots of damage and carnage so that the fundies can pick up the pieces and rule a pan-islamic state among the ruins.

They also want our asses out of Saudi Arabia.
They also want the house of Saud to fall.

I'm conflicted because I kind of want the same thing...but I don't want them to get what they want. So, do I become a monarchist and support the house of Saud just to spite Al Queda? Is there some chance we can do in SA what we've done in Iraq, even though the arabians are much more likely to want a fundamentalist jihad kind of government?

Then there's that "kill them all" option, which although on Friday afternoon many of us were wanting, it's good that we're not in charge.

Anyway, I'm not conflicted when it comes to the need to kill the terrorists before they kill us. Just, what do we do with all those folks between Andalusia and Oceania who aren't planning on killing us, but are rooting for the terrorists?

--scott

A funny thing happened while Dan Rather was doing Abu Gharib every night for 3 months: the Palestinians lost the second intifada. That's why I still think the Middle East is solvable, if our leaders are strong enough. Sharon clearly is. I have huge doubts about Bush though.

Great idea. I mean, blowing the shit out of the middle east won't encourage even further retaliation. The middle east problem is a product of a combination of violence and outsiders meddling with their political systems for reasons that are purely economic. I'm not saying it's right for them to be sawing people's heads off, but by blowing the shit out of them you are doing the same thing and making the problem even worse. It strengthens all of the Occidentalist views they are already preaching. The east vs. west conflict is a vicious circle of one side retaliating against another, by spewing hatred like this towards them you are no better than they are. Terrorism is ALWAYS wrong-- no matter which direction the guns are pointed.

Justin,

It sint terrorism Im preaching. Its payback. They deserve it.

All it has ever been is 'payback'. They think the same thing. I mean, they are just thinking 'hey let's cut this guys head off, it's payback'. It won't solve anything. I have noticed you are a fan of the 'fuck che' motto that some people support. You are very clever for this. Guevara was a murderer. It just seems a bit hypocritical to condemn what he does, then somehow justify blowing up the middle east. If history is any guide-don't fret-you will all get your wish and the middle east will get blown up. But I guarantee this will only make the problem worse. They will be more pissed than ever. They have a right to be annoyed with the past. They have suffered injustice in the past. The US has now, too. It hurts, doesn't it? So people should realize that it all just needs to stop. Both sides are going about this the wrong way, which is why it keeps getting worse. The world sucks ass right now because everyone hates their neighbour.

Justin,

If it isnt obvious to you that, no matter what we do - be it leaving Arabia, cutting off economic ties, cutting all ties with Israel, ETC.. - they want to kill us and destroy our way of life then you really need to come back to reality. We dont live in an ideal world.

I certainly cant love my neighbor if he kills my family. Sorry bub. Preach peace to them, not me.

Val,

Please do not question my connection with reality. The entire middle east is not composed of Islamic fundamentalists, but they are the ones that cause the damage. When the West blows the shit out of them they get support from the general population. In the middle east it is the fundamentalists that wield the sword.

I am not saying we need to love them. It is true that we have done some things in the past we shouldn't have (if you don't believe me look up 'IRAN' in the encyclopedia). Does this give them the right to saw off your head if you decide to go there? Of course not.

I am just saying that alone, religious radicals become more powerful and more pissed off every time the US flexes it's muslces in the middle east. There is collateral damage every time. If they were left alone to begin with, things would be fine- there would still be some fundamentalists, but I doubt they would be mad enough to go to such extremes as they did on Sept 11. If we never fucked with them they wouldn't be as mad as they are now. Don't get me wrong; events like sept 11th cannot be justified no matter what. But every time the US intervenes in the middle east people die. You can't honestly say that if we went and caused even more damage in the middle east, they would just leave us alone, can you?

Forget the past, go on the defensive, and moral will die down. Stop giving them reasons to hate us. Our lifestyle is only part of it (a small part at that).

I know we don't live in an ideal world. Sometimes military intervention is neccessary, but not every time. The whole middle east situation has spiralled way out of control BECAUSE violence is used in an attempt to resolve every single conflict.

Val, this weekend my brother came to the conslusion that we should warn the terrorists that each time they hurt one of ours we, Americans, will hgurt them. My brother elaborated that we should warn them that it wouldn;t be our government or military who acted, but us individually. He was stupmed when I pressed for some logistical info as to how we woul accomplish this. He said that maybe some American "insurgents" need to kick some ass.

Keep in mind, we were drinking beer on a lake in 105 degree temps. :-)