May 25, 2005
Fontova on Carriles
A Tale of Two Terrorists
Via Newsmax
Humberto Fontova
Wednesday, May 25, 2005
The mainstream media are in a tizzy. They can hardly contain their glee. They have a Cuban exile to bash, you see, one recently arrested for illegal entry into the U.S. The mainstream media hammer away daily that this man, Luis Posada Carriles, is "linked to terrorism," more specifically to the bombing of a Cuban airliner that killed 73 people in October 1976.
Posada Carriles has Venezuelan residency status. He has a long history of anti-Castro militancy, once lived in Miami and worked for the CIA. Plus he has contacts among the "Miami Mafia" (i.e., Cuban-Americans who refuse to recite the talking points on Castro/Cuba handed out by the mainstream media-Democratic National Committee axis). So yes, he'll do magnificently as a media whipping boy.
Recall that during the Elian media orgy even normally cagey pundits like Mark Steyn, John Leo and Tony Snow swallowed the Castroite spin hook, line and sinker.
Well, here we have it again. The epidemic of vituperation against this Cuban-exile "terrorist" has proved highly contagious and is crossing the aisles. Dick Morris, writing in the New York Post, says that Carriles "richly deserves to face a Castro firing squad."
I don't know if Posada Carriles is guilty of this bombing. I can't say for certain either way. But the Havana-incited media orgy against him leaves out many pertinent facts. As in the Elian case, Castro's U.S. echo chamber again chants constantly about "the rule of law." Yet they neglect to mention that Carriles has been twice acquitted of the crime. Doesn't "the rule of law" also mean protection against double jeopardy?
>From the New York Times to USA Today to the Miami Herald, all the big guns of the mainstream media want this anti-Castro "terrorist," who was recently arrested for illegal entry into the U.S., immediately deported.
While hosting "Nightline," Ted Koppel outdid himself on the Carriles case, interviewing – along with the usual Castro parrots like Anna Louise Bardach and Peter Kornbluh – the highly reliable and impartial legal expert, Ricardo Alarcon, also known as Castro's "President of the Cuban National Assembly."
Ted Koppel habitually sneers and snorts when interviewing a Republican senator. He was a veritable Vishinsky when interrogating Swiftvet John O'Neill. But Koppel's demeanor was markedly different as he addressed the propagandist for a mass-murdering Stalinist government, who broadcast from Havana demanding Posada Carriles' immediate extradition. Koppel mutated into a purring little puddycat.
"I think you're teasing me a little bit here, Mr. Alarcon," the newly amiable Koppel answered a tart comment by the Communist weasel.
An intrepid interviewer could have had a field day. "Mr. Alarcon, here you ask for the extradition of Mr. Carriles to Venezuela [read Cuba]," Koppel might have started, "yet the Cuban government itself is currently harboring 77 fugitives from U.S justice, many on the FBI's most wanted list. And unlike Mr. Carriles, who has already been acquitted twice, by independent courts, of any involvement in the plane bombing you accuse him of – and who recently passed a lie detector test on the plane bombing matter – unlike all of this, Mr. Alarcon, many of the U.S. fugitives your government harbors even as we speak have been convicted by U.S. juries of murder and terror. Yet your government has repeatedly and scornfully rebuffed every request for their return."
"Also, Mr. Alarcon, protection against double jeopardy is a legal principle that goes back to ancient Greece," Koppel might have continued. "The United States, the United Nations, the European Union, the Organization of American States, the International Criminal Court and the Venezuelan government itself when it tried Mr. Carriles all uphold this principle.
"Yet now you demand that the United States become an accomplice in triple jeopardy – and at the request of Stalinists who will promptly drag him to a Stalinist show trial, then a firing squad?
"Also, Mr. Alarcon, according to our Defense Department, over 42,000 guerrillas and terrorists from three different continents – everyone from the PLO to the Tupamaros to the IRA to SWAPO to the Black Panthers – received their explosives training in Cuba from 1959-1985. The death toll from their terrorism reaches into the thousands, not to mention the death toll from your government's use of poison gas against Angolan villagers. To some people this makes your newfound concern over terrorism seem somewhat suspect, sir. Any comments on that?"
Dream on, amigos. Though all of the above is thoroughly documented and easily available to any "Nightline" producer after five minutes of research, those "gallant crusaders for truth" (as Columbia Journalism Schools hails its graduates) wouldn't DREAM of such impertinence when confronting a Communist liar (excuse my redundancy.)
"Documents link" is a constant phrase in every article on Posada Carriles. This "revelation" had Castro's parrots squirming in their seats with anticipation during the "Nightline" Posada bashfest. Even better, many of these documents are "recently declassified." Wow! You know how that plays on a headline, especially when these "documents" all "link" the Cuban exile to the blowing up of a Castro airliner.
Fine, but as I said – and as five minutes of research by "Nightline's" producers could have confirm – the implications in these documents have all had their day in court. The result was two acquittals, one by a civilian court and another by a military court. Somehow "Nightline" neglected to mention this detail.
Castro has snapped his fingers and – as usual – the mainstream media have snapped to attention. He nodded impatiently and they lined up obediently. Now they're acting dutifully on their marching orders and talking points. Castro is an old hand at this. We saw it most vividly during the Elian orgy, but it started much earlier.
Back in 1957, when the only thing he lorded over was a raggedy band of a dozen "guerrillas" (winos, wastrels and petty crooks) in Cuba's Sierra Maestra mountains, Castro was approached by some of his wealthy urban backers (they all scrambled into exile for their very lives three years later, by the way).
"What can we do?" They asked. "How can we help your glorious rebellion? We can write you some checks. We can buy you some arms. We can recruit more men. Tell us, Fidel, what can we do to help?"
"For now," answered Castro, "get me a New York Times reporter up here."
Bingo! The rest is history. They quickly complied and within weeks Castro was being equated with Robin Hood on the front page of the world's most prestigious papers. Within a year and a half he was running Cuba while being hailed as "the George Washington of Cuba!" by everyone from Jack Paar to Walter Lippmann to Ed Sullivan to Harry Truman.
(One prominent American who wasn't snookered was Vice President Richard Nixon, and one American publication that bucked the "Castro-as-democratic hero!" tide was Human Events, who outed him as a Communist terrorist from day one.)
Alas, these were voices in the wilderness.
The media spin on the twice-acquitted anti-Communist Posada versus their spin on convicted Communist terrorists also begs for scrutiny. To this task I now apply myself.
"Nightline," the New York Times, USA Today and the rest of the mainstream media cabal might be interested that I've recently "uncovered documents" that "link " last year's Presidential Medal of Freedom winner – a man they've been hymning to the high heavens for the past 20 years as hero and saint – to terrorism! But with a major difference: When these documents had their day in court, they convicted the media's hero-saint (Nelson Mandela) of terrorism. How's that!
"The preparation, manufacture and use of explosives, including 210,000 hand grenades, 48,000 anti-personnel mines, 1,500 time devices, 144 tons of ammonium nitrate, 21.6 tons of aluminum powder and a ton of black powder. 193 counts of terrorism committed between 1961 and 1963" say the documents.
But those documents come from the prosecutor on behalf of the odious Apartheid regime, some might counter (whereas Posada Carriles' trial in a Stalinist nation will be scrupulously fair, I suppose.)
In fact, South Africa was not a totalitarian country in 1964. It had a totally independent judiciary and Mandela's trial had observers from around the world. Here's the March 1964 London Observer (no bunker of right-wingers, no defender of apartheid) that covered the trial where Nelson Mandela, head of the ANC's (African National Congress') terrorist wing was convicted of terrorism. "The trial has been properly conducted," wrote correspondent Anthony Sampson (who later wrote Mandela's authorized biography). "The judge, Mr Justice Quartus de Wet, has been scrupulously fair."
Here's Amnesty International (again, no Klan of rabid right-wingers) in 1985 explaining why it refused to list the media's hero-saint as a political prisoner: "Nelson Mandela had participated in planning acts of sabotage and inciting violence, so that he could no longer fulfill the criteria for the classification of political prisoners."
"The cause of Communism is the greatest cause in the history of mankind!'" proclaimed Nelson Mandela in 1961. "There's one place where Fidel Castro stands out head and shoulders above the rest. That is in his love for human rights and liberty!" proclaimed Saint Mandela as Castro awarded him Cuba's prestigious Playa Giron Award.
When Nelson Mandela first visited the U.S. in 1990, Accuracy in Media termed the tumultuous and laudatory media coverage as "Mandela Mania." The hero of oppressed people everywhere!" (ABC); "A larger-than-life figure!" (CNN); "A virtual symbol of freedom!" ( CBS). "His name has a mystical quality!" gushed Dan Rather. "A worldwide hero!" continued Gunga Dan, who went on to compare Mandela to Mother Teresa.
Other reports compared Mandela to the pope, Jesus Christ and Moses. The New York Times devoted 23 pages for laudatory articles on Saint Mandela in one single week. Ted Koppel hosted an ABC "Town Meeting" with Mandela where every question was sugar and spice and everything nice.
Interestingly, at that very time the U.S. State Department, along with the U.S. Defense Department, both listed Mandela's ANC as a terrorist organization.
"With our necklaces we will liberate this country," crowed Winnie Mandela in April 1986 about the practice of capturing fellow South African blacks, binding them, drenching them with gasoline, putting a tire around their necks and burning them alive, a crazed mob whooping in glee as the victims writhed and shrieked in agony. Mrs. Mandela's incitement of this charming practice was actually captured on film.
Naturally, nary a one of those intrepid, fearless and cheeky Beltway reporter broached these touchy matters.
By now the former head of the ANC's terror wing has won everything from the Congressional Gold Medal (presented by Maxine Waters) to the Nobel Peace Prize. He has squares, parks and boulevards named after him everyplace from New York City to New Delhi. He has honorary degrees everyplace from the Sorbonne to Harvard. He has honorary citizenship everyplace from Greece to Canada.
Bill Clinton hailed him as "a gift to humanity!" When awarding him the U.S. Presidential Medal of Freedom (America's highest civilian award) in 2002, President Bush hailed Nelson Mandela as "the most revered statesman of our time."
While addressing the International Women's conference in Johannesburg a few months later, Mandela thanked President Bush with the following: "If there is a country that has committed unspeakable atrocities in the world, it is the United States of America! [wild and deafening applause] They don't care for human beings!"
The recent New York Times editorial urging the prompt arrest and extradition of Luis Posada Carriles is titled "A Single Standard for Terrorists."
Fine, New York Times. Then why such an editorial? Why not nominate Luis Posada Carriles for the Nobel Peace Price and the Presidential Medal of Freedom?
Posada Carriles' lawyer should instruct his client to start bashing America, to start hailing Mao and Ho Chi Minh, and to deck himself out in a Che Guevara T-shirt. Then we might get somewhere.
Posted by Val Prieto at May 25, 2005 08:03 AM
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» MORE ON POSADA CARRILES from Publius Pundit
The Luis Posada Carriles terrorism case has drawn a consensus in the mainstream media about the guy's guilt and the need to throw him in jail even if it is, or especially if it is, in Castro's Cuba or Chavez's Venezuela. Cuban Americans have a differen... [Read More]
Tracked on May 25, 2005 10:18 AM
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Tracked on May 27, 2005 01:08 AM
Comments
It's always a delight to see Humberto Fontova's name and work. As usual, it's well-reasoned, well-documented, chock full of solid argumentation and deep insights.
If you haven't seen/purchased/read his latest book "Fidel, Hollywood's Favorite Tyrant," you should be logging on to Amazon.com *right now* and ordering a copy. And maybe a second one for a friend. Or a foe that needs awakening. This book provides wonderful ammunition for the Forces of Good to counter the arguments of such
misguided fools as "Barba Blanca" --who is really Barba Roja.
Bravo, Fontova, bravo!
Disclaimer: I don't know Mr. Fontova personally, nor do I have any financial interest in his book or other works. But I *love* the way he thinks!
Julio C. Zangroniz
Posted by: Julio C. Zangroniz at May 25, 2005 09:36 AM
I've read it, and it is brilliant. I second Julio's opinion about buying multiple copies. I have already had to lend it out three times. It's a fast read, but very educational.
Posted by: George L. Moneo at May 25, 2005 09:48 AM
Well said!!! I always enjoy his truthfullness. But my heart is once again stirred to why do we Cuban-Americans stop with words? For some 40 odd years we have talked and talked and talked.....
If we really wanted and I assume we do want a free Cuba there would be one. The issue is not whether we want Cuba free, but whether we are willing to pay the price. We Cubans have succeeded in America there are literally millions of us with millions of dollars(as a whole). Why do we wait for others or time to produce a change. Cuba was not changed into what it is by waiting and talking nor will it change back by the same. yes I love and respect the articles, the conventions, the memories, but none of these things will produce change. As a conservative and Republican I am tired of the election year "Cuba will someday be free" and we Cubans selling our souls to whoever makes the same hollow statement.
America is making millions in sales to Cuba (embargo?)so they have no motivation for a change. Will this generation of Cubans die only with a memory of what was and a hope of what could be? Yes I am guilty of complaining and hoping, but I have had enough. I cannot live with myself and just stand by and watch and wait while Cuba and Cubans rot in Cuba. The question remains also whether the majority in Cuba want change. I wish to believe that they do. Forgive my ranting and by no means is this intended to insult especially those who have made an effort. But the time for talk and memories has past. It is the time for action. Pardon me for my zeal, but Mr. Fontova (who as I said I admire his writings) has stirred my heart again. As David said regarding the giant Goliath. Is there not a cause?
Posted by: pototo at May 25, 2005 09:54 AM
A pathetic attempt to compare Posada Carriles to Nelson Mandela can only come from a "journalist" who writes for a newspaper founded by Moonie cult leader Sun Yung Moon.
This is the type of stuff that discredits Castro's critics at large.
Posted by: Hilda at May 25, 2005 11:03 AM
Hilda,
You fail to see the forrest for the trees on this one. This article is not so much a comparison of Carriles and Mandela as it is an indictment on the Mainstream Media and its obvious bias on this issue.
And if I may ask, how many times do you believe Carriles should be tried? Why didnt Koppel or any of the other MSM outlets state the fact that Carriles had been tried twice for his alleged involvement in this crime and acquitted? Why havent any of the MSM outlets offered up a dissenting opinion from the other side of the argument? And what about that woman from New Jersey, whatever her name is that has been living in Cuba while having been found guilty of murdering a cop in the states? Or what about that list of KNOWN terrorists I posted the other day?
This article isnt about Carriles vs. Mandela, its about the Media's double standard when it comes to anything related to Cuban exiles.
Of course, you do not address the issue here at all, you criticize your own without so much as even a nod that what Fontova is staing is valid.
Posted by: Val Prieto at May 25, 2005 11:25 AM
It is TRULY amazing how the USA media treats any member of the Cult Clan isn't it?
Coppel is infamous for his HIGH tone of respect for these thugs.
I asked a New York Times reporter once why the kid gloves when dealing with ANYONE from a repressed country , and his UTTERLY amazing answer was
"Well, it is VERY difficult to get these people to agree to an on camera interview so when you do you DO get them , you must make sure not to offend them"
Now, is THAT the epitome of hypocrisy in the media?
Oh what I would give if any of the Kastro Squad would face Fontova on an interview.
Or a Dennis Miller!
Humberto has outdone himself again, kudos.
Now what we need is to get Humberto in front of a Ted Koppel so that he can make Coppel cry like a lil school girl.
Posted by: KillCastro at May 25, 2005 11:59 AM
HEY EVERYONE? Why are you being blinded by the U.S. attempt to take away attention from posada. THey are calling assata shakur a terrorist when she was not the one to kill a plane filled with CUban sports men. Posada was the one to blow up a plane filled with innocent people. If you guys continue to defend posada you will be exposed showing the hypocracy you gguys have in you. Second Assata shakur didn't kill the cop, yet they still tried her as if she did. We will never know the whole story on this topic. I just hope that people wake up and have an open mind when talking about posada, He is a real assasin.
Posted by: truth at May 25, 2005 01:43 PM
HEY EVERYONE? Why are you being blinded by the U.S. attempt to take away attention from posada. THey are calling assata shakur a terrorist when she was not the one to kill a plane filled with CUban sports men. Posada was the one to blow up a plane filled with innocent people. If you guys continue to defend posada you will be exposed showing the hypocracy you gguys have in you. Second Assata shakur didn't kill the cop, yet they still tried her as if she did. We will never know the whole story on this topic. I just hope that people wake up and have an open mind when talking about posada, He is a real assasin.
Posted by: truth at May 25, 2005 01:44 PM
Val, do you have links to his aquitals, por favor? Your blog is the first I've heard of it, so far I've only gotten the 'terrorist' arrested in US, and 'send him back to Cuba'. I'd rather read all the information available. Even in Spanish is fine. :)
Posted by: Rhianna at May 25, 2005 01:44 PM
assata shakur and posada have no common ground, posada is a terrorist. Assata shakur is not. eventhough shakur has been laced on the terrorist list by the fbi, it is known to be a ploy to deviate attention from the posada case. if you guys fail to realize this then you guys are bigger hypocrites than I though you were ( val, george) Val no one is looking for you, your not important except to those in your little world. You don't even make a dent in anyones life
Posted by: davis at May 25, 2005 01:49 PM
Hey truth, you certainly dont aim to live up to your name, do you?
What part about Posada being acquitted twice for the alleged crime do you not understand? And what part about "Assata" being convicted of murder in a fair trial do you have a problem understanding?
And I guess you just didnt have the time to scroll down and see that list of fugitives harbored in Cuba all these years either, right?
or I guess you dont know that fidel castro himslef began his "political" career as a terrorist when terrorism wasnt cool? Colombia, 1948 to be exact. Look it up before you open your unlearned mouth.
And I guess that all the evidence of fidel castro's Cuba being the gateway of the illegal drug trade for almost 3 decades isnt worth mentioning either, right?
Gimme a break.
Posted by: Val Prieto at May 25, 2005 01:50 PM
VAl, I new that you would stand up for a terrorist that killed your own people (innocent people) YOur just like the rest of the hypocrits. YOu will defend even a terrorist in order to have something against castro. it make you no better thatn posada if you defend them
Posted by: davis at May 25, 2005 01:53 PM
Ah, yes, davis. Such brave words coming from such a brave fighter of the revolution. Let me ask you something, you nitwit, were have I ever mentioned in this blog that someone is after me? Find it it you can please, because it would be news to me.
You are nothing but another sad cultist, spewing the rhetoric without getting even close to understanding its true meaning.
And let me offer up an observation, davis, had I not made a dent in anyone's life, especially yours, you wouldnt be here now spouting your verbal diarheah, now would you?
Pathetic little man.
Posted by: Val Prieto at May 25, 2005 01:54 PM
Davis, this will be my last response to you before I ban you from my site. I suggest you read this blog in its entirety and find one instance where I state that Posada should not be responsible for any crime he has been found guilty of. That said, he was tried and acquitted TWICE in Venezuela for the crime of which you speak. Now, not having any other information other than conjecture and hyperbole from the Cuban regime's side, I base my views on that.
If you care to offer up some damming evidence that proves his guilt beyond a reasonable doubt then I will be the first to call for Posada's head. Otherwise, I have only the castro regime's verbal tirade - used, undoubtedly, to detract attention from the Assembly this past weekend - and the fact that there were fair trials, both criminal and civil, that acquitted the man to base my opinion on.
Posted by: Val Prieto at May 25, 2005 02:03 PM
I think what is really upsetting these nitwitoid-cretinoid kagastro-worshippers, who all seem to have trouble with spelling and grammar, no doubt this being a symptom of brain-cell death caused by consumption of hallucinogenic substances, is the fear that they will no longer be able to easily get said substances once a free Cuba stops allowing itself to be a transit point for illegal drugs.
And since you're helping spread the truth, you are doing your part in bringing about a free Cuba, aren't you? Keep flailin' 'em, brother!
Posted by: Alberto Quiroga at May 25, 2005 02:10 PM
And furthermore, davis, or dave or truth or whatever pseudonym you wish to hide behind of today, you have done nothing but email me and comment repeatedly on this blog to instigate just such a reaction from yourself.
Let me put iot to you straight, asshole, once and for all.
Had Posada been found guilty through a fair trial, then I would be the first to agree that he is, in fact, a terrorist. But, since he was acquitted twice, and barring any new evidence to the contrary, I will afford him the same rights that any suspected terrorist in this countryu is afforded.
Posted by: Val Prieto at May 25, 2005 02:13 PM
I see you have a lot of support Val, I am happy for you but those who suffer are over in the island. I am not here for a shouting match with you, let me tell you something you know what is worst than being blind? not wanting to see. open your mind val. the embargo only makes our families suffer. Castro will be rich regardless of the embargo.
Posted by: davis at May 25, 2005 02:16 PM
Val, you know deep inside he is guilty of bombing and killing our people, its a shame that you would give this guy chances that should not be given to him.
Posted by: davis at May 25, 2005 02:19 PM
Davis,
First, I have no doubt in my mind that you are not Cuban. Had you been Cuban, you would have had the balls to comment here at least with a viable email address where you and I and anyone else that wanted to would be able to discuss this matter privately. But, that would actually take some kind of manhood from you which, as is totally obviously from the fact that you prefer anonymity to actually standing up for something like a man, would be totally impossible for you.
Second, how dare you even presume to know or understand what I do or dont know deep down inside?
You arent one of those pastors for peace moroons are you? cause you sure do sound like a fidel ass licker.
I will say it once again, submit evidentiary proof that Posada carriles is guilty of that bombing and I will agree with you here on the blog, in public, with an apology. Otherwise, go spew to your Deomcratic Underground echo chamber.
You arent by any chance in Parlin, New jersey, are you?
Posted by: Val Prieto at May 25, 2005 02:29 PM
these guerillas you speak of, the winos, wastrels and petty crooks, these ARE the SAME ones that DEFEATED the army and sent batista along with thousands on the run right? the same bunch that eventually sent millions scurrying into the night.. see, this is why castro is still in power, and why after his death, the swift change that many are hoping for WILL NOT come.. the element of cubans refugees who attmept to lump everything into one faction.. who refuse to see the forest for the trees.. cuba was paradise, and anyone who says otherwise is communist.. first off, castros hands are tinted red with blood? yes.. the guy is probably one of the worst humans to grace the earth.. but so are so many others before him, batista and his men commited similar atrocities.. paco perez, father of your patron mother ninoska was guilty of murder of young men and the rape and torture of young women.. if castros band was such a rag tag bunch, how did they succeed? why was it that the mass population didnt rise up? maybe many saw a need for change.. all i read here is from that group of cubans who every year have to listen to a tia, or a abuela cry at noche buena saying between sobs "el proximo ano in cuba".. how many years will you listen to that? how many years have you heard that already? and you still believe it? either posada cariles is a terrorist, a murderer just like castro, or he is your typical cuban, all words, no action.. right or wrong, and however misguided, castro and his man rose up, put their balls on the line and succeeded.. you want to admire someone, admire the bay of pigs veterans, at least they went and tried to do something, but posada cariles is either a coward, who talk a big game but did NOTHING, or, he is a terrorist who killed innocents trying to strike a blow against castros tyranny.. pick your poison..
Posted by: daniel at May 25, 2005 03:29 PM
Val, It’s not necessary to tell you because I’m certain you‘re quite aware, but I’m going to say it anyway. What you have done through this blog and continue to do on a daily basis inspires those who love freedom and democracy and, enrages those who defend the communist panacea Oliver Stone, Danny Glover, et. al. subscribe to and recommend but would never actually live in. The truth is bigger and brighter than the sun and it can never be shut out. Estas en el lado de la verdad.
Posted by: tati at May 25, 2005 03:34 PM
Val,
Assata Shakur’s "conviction" was an absolute sham. The evidence and testimony from the state troopers was shaky at best, and downright criminal at worst. She was charged with murder of the state trooper and her own partner Zayd Shakur when in fact the paraffin test proved that she never even fired a gun. Forensics actually proved that Assata was shot by the cowardly trooper from behind while her hands were in the air.
The point is Assata is not guilty of the crimes of which she was convicted. She is fortunate to have escaped with her life.
Posted by: Carl Muhammad at May 25, 2005 03:40 PM
...Ahh Mandela, the weasel Xhusa tribe member that was lured to the Apartheid Cause by the corporal rewards of a younger woman. this fraud of a revolutianary even abandoned wife and young children shortly after getting a brief taste Winny's young 'cat'.
The same Winny that should have been hung a long time ago for the brutal murder of young boy named Stompie Sepie.
(moral of the story, never underestimate the power of cat)
Posted by: Lilo at May 25, 2005 03:55 PM
Raising the stakes to bring in a cop-killer
Feds are offering a $1 million reward to snare Chesimard, now in Cuba
Monday, May 02, 2005BY RICK HEPP
Star-Ledger Staff
The U.S. Department of Justice has posted a $1 million bounty for the capture of New Jersey's most-wanted fugitive: convicted cop-killer JoAnne Chesimard, the former Black Liberation Army member who escaped a state prison a quarter of a century ago.
The reward will be announced by Attorney General Peter Harvey and State Police Superintendent Rick Fuentes at the State Police headquarters in West Trenton today, -- the 32nd anniversary of the slaying of state Trooper Werner Foerster during a gunfight on the New Jersey Turnpike. Chesimard was convicted of murdering Foerster by shooting him twice as he lay wounded.
The $1 million will be the largest reward ever set by the federal government on a New Jersey fugitive, state police say. Police had offered $150,000 for Chesimard's capture since 1998.
Authorities know Chesimard is living in Cuba under political asylum. They hope this new reward will provide more incentive for bounty hunters.
"She is now 120 pounds of money," State Police Superintendent Rick Fuentes said. "It is going to exert pressures that weren't in place nationally and internationally before. And we're going to follow up to make sure everybody is aware of this both inside and outside of Cuba."
Harvey and Fuentes also will announce that the Justice Department has placed Chesimard on a variety of international terrorist watch lists for the first time.
"We owe it to the family (of the slain trooper)," Fuentes said. "We owe it to the New Jersey State Police and we owe it to every citizen in the state of New Jersey to bring her back and we will."
Harvey and Fuentes last Friday were on hand with troopers and Foerster's family to name a Route 18 bridge in East Brunswick over the Turnpike the Werner Foerster Overpass.
Chesimard, now 57 and living under the name Assata Shakur, was convicted in 1977 by a Middlesex County jury of murdering Foerster during a gunbattle on the New Jersey Turnpike in East Brunswick. A second trooper, James Harper, was wounded.
The 1973 shootout began minutes after Harper pulled over Chesimard and two companions for a faulty tail light, according to State Police files. Foerster, patrolling nearby, responded to provide back up.
The troopers asked the driver, Clark Squire, to step out of the vehicle after his license did not match the sedan's registration, the files show. As Foerster questioned Squire, Harper walked around the car to speak with Chesimard and her brother-in-law, James Costan.
That's when shots were fired from within the car and both troopers returned fire, according to police. A bullet struck Foerster, knocking him to the ground and leaving him incapacitated.
"Chesimard then took the weapon away from Foerster and shot him in the neck and head," Fuentes said. "This isn't the result of a toe-to-toe exchange. This is an execution and there's a clear distinction."
Chesimard's attorneys denied she shot Foerster, saying she was too seriously wounded to pull a trigger after being struck twice by shots from Harper's gun.
After the vehicle drove away, Harper, dazed from a gunshot wound to the left shoulder, staggered to a nearby State Police barracks.
Within minutes, police found the vehicle abandoned on the side of the road five miles south of the shooting, the files show. Troopers arrested Chesimard after she walked toward them with her hands in the air. The body of Costan, who died in the gunfight, was found near the car.
Squire, whom troopers saw running from the car, was captured the next day in a wooded area in East Brunswick. Now 67, he remains in a Pennsylvania prison serving a life sentence. Last August, a state parole board panel denied his request for release.
In 1979, Chesimard escaped from the Clinton Correctional Institution for Women in Hunterdon County -- now known as the Edna Mahan Correctional Facility for Women -- when three gunmen posing as visitors took two guards hostage and drove her out of the facility's maximum-security unit in a van.
Three months ago, State Police sent Lt. Col. Juan Mattos to an international policing conference in the Dominican Republic to ask Caribbean, Central American and South American authorities for help in arresting Chesimard.
"We want to make sure she does not have a way to escape from Cuba and we want to apply pressure to her while she is in Cuba," Harvey said.
About a year ago, Harvey and Fuentes approached Joseph Billy, then Special Agent in Charge of the FBI's Newark office and now deputy assistant director for counter-intelligence in Washington, D.C. Billy helped them apply to the FBI to increase the reward. Harvey and Fuentes presented their arguments directly to FBI Director Robert Mueller, and U.S. Attorney General Alberto Gonzales signed the order last Thursday.
Rick Hepp covers criminal justice. He can be reached at
Posted by: Lilo at May 25, 2005 04:01 PM
Comment edited by admin.
Please stay on topic.
Posted by: YUCA at May 25, 2005 04:23 PM
Daniel, I will not respond to your myopic and con=mpletely assinine rhetoric save for one question: WHAT DO YOU DO TO HELP THOSE IN CUBA?
Carl Muhamed,
We have in the United States what is called an appeals process, where everyone convicted of a crime has his or her chance to appeal the jury's verdict. Just as you are calling for Posada to be extradited and returned to, I am assuming, Venezuela, the US is calling for whatever her name is to be extradited and returned to the US for the crime for which she was convicted. She is entitled to her appeal through a coiurt of law.
Dude process must apply to all, regardless of ones own personal beliefs.
Posted by: Val Prieto at May 25, 2005 04:25 PM
Yuca, Embargoes never work? What do you think happened to apartheid in S Africa?
Posted by: Kathleen at May 25, 2005 04:44 PM
Robin, looks like the Trolletariat is out en force today... Hand me the pendejo repellent bat spray!
Posted by: Batman at May 25, 2005 05:19 PM
val, its not my place to help them, if they want to rise up, by all means let them.. but im not going to tell THEM how to lead their lives.. that you dont address anything that i bring up is more of the problem.. for far too long, a FAILED policy has mired and muddies the "cuba issue".. that change was needed in cuba NO ONE can deny, except for those in the "inner circle".. that change is needed today, no one will deny either.. but no one ever wants to talk about perez rorua being batistiano in the early days, then, when the music changed, people forget about him glorifying castro.. no one wants to say that many of those leading the charge today want to be in power tomorrow.. mas canosa was grooming himself to be prez in cuba, and just became another one of those who failed in their quest to outlive castro.. and assinine rhetoric?? thats what the far right cuban element has been proclaiming for years, and look what its gotten you.. the freaking song remains the same, and nothing has improved.. let me fill you in on sometihng: outside of miami, very few people subscribe to this "hard line" of the far right.. travel around the world, and you will hear an entirely different version of cuba.. why is it that we only hear this version here? im not defending castro at all, but i will never be a part of the extremeism that has polluted this issue for far too long.. you seem to be an intelligent person, so try not to deal in absolutes.. YES batista was a tyrant, just like castro, and the very same things that happened then happen now.. there WAS hunger with batista, and there IS hunger with castro.. there were human rights violations under both.. but no one ever seems willing to talk about those before 1959.. are those who batista killed "bien muertos" for their beliefs? what im getting at here is, you cant defend one and condem another, which brings us back around to posada cariles.. either he WAS involved in those activities, and is a murderer, jsut like castro, like batista, like osama, or, he is just another one of those miami cubans, full of hot air, all talk, no action.. and for those who may feel he fights the good fight and a noble cause, well, lets just say that 9.11, in the minds of those who executed the act felt they were fighting the good fight.. the road to hell is paved with good intentions.. its all wrong, no matter how you look at it
Posted by: daniel at May 25, 2005 05:21 PM
My Friends:
I don't know what happened that night in NJ only the people involved really know what happened, and if she is guilty, she's not here and out of our hair anyway. Do you really think she is better off in Cuba, a prison without bars?
About Posada Carriles he was acquitted , and just like the OJ issue we have to leave it alone regardless of personal feelings. His guilt is a moot point. I will never ever defend a killer of the innocent, hell I’m not in favor of the death penalty anymore much less blowing up a plain, but once a man is declared innocent he must be treated that way.
Now those of you who refer to us as hypocrites, how do you know? You see, if this were about money, we would have wanted the embargo lifted decades ago so we could cash in. But we haven't.
Many of you say we are obsessed, maybe. But I bet my last dime that if anyone came into your house and took it and everything you own and declared that it belonged to the revolution you would be quite pissed. In fact you would do what ever it takes to get it back from the thief. I don't believe anyone can blame us for that.
Batista was a thug that much we know and he took power by force that is a fact. However, his atrocities though many were exaggerated by both the New York Time and La Bohemia. I don’t remember his name right now, but the editor and chief of La Bohemia wrote that in his suicide note before he blew his brains out in Venezuela. And yes, at first the majority of the Cuban people including the rich were seduced by castro. He was welcomed on the promise that we would have a free and democratic society. That was a lie! Cubans in general have a good grasp of democracy, we are among the most educated and professional people in the western hemisphere; we are not a bunch dumb yahoos.
Denial you have a good point that its time we get off of our asses. However you fail to see that had the Kennedy administration not given into everything the soviets wanted, Cubans were ready to launch attacks from Costa Rica and Guatemala on our own. The US government did not allow us to fight for ourselves. You need to do a little homework.
I don't know who on this blog is Cuban and who is not, but if any of us have any notion of creating a free and democratic Cuba we better start with ourselves here and now. I love my countries and feel the same rage most of you feel at the injustice that all Cubans suffer. However, we have to bury the hatchet, at least among ourselves. The recovery of Cuba will take generations. (I hope I’m wrong) The fact is that we need to start working on creating an infrastructure as a base for the restoration of human rights and much needed commerce. We must do this together, inspite of our different political views. This will be the only way to form a democracy.
Daniel, truth, and barba blanca: You have all made your points but I don’t see anything that resembles a fact. Nothing any of you have brought up has any support, yet all of the information presented by Fantova, you should read his book by the way it really is very good, has concrete back up. You can’t argue with facts. You may think what you want about us that is a God given right, but come up with an argument that has some substance. There is no hypocrisy in loving one's country. Nor is there any hypocrisy in wanting to right a wrong. Unless you are one of us you do not know what drives us anymore than I can know what a Jew feels whose entire family was exterminated by hitler. Stop judging us and either join us or leave us alone. Either way, get your facts right.
Posted by: mojoman at May 25, 2005 05:47 PM
Daniel,
Sitting in front of your computer and criticizing the Miami Cubans out of frustration for their lack of success in defeating castro isn't going to solve the problem either.
Listen...I've been critical of some things the "hard line" has done in the past, but why does it always have to be them to take the blame for the problems in Cuba? Why can't ALL the hand-wringing, criticism, and outrage be pointed towards castro? If the Miami Cubans have it all wrong, then what do you think is the right solution?
Do you think people like Val take the time to post views on blogs just because they have nothing else to do? Or do you think it's because he believes that getting the word out about castro and his thugs is his way of being part of the solution.
Yes, Batista wasn't a saint, but going back and comparing dictators isn't going to make Cuba any more free.
Posted by: Robert at May 25, 2005 05:49 PM
TERRORISTS AND TERRORISM
Luis Posada Carriles, obviously, knowing that Castro's Secret Police were entering Venezuela and being granted "immediate citizenship" by Chavez' government (because it is no longer that of the Venezuelan people, but fast changing to a communist dictatorship, as you will see), took the only course of action he could by leaving the country. He knew that a communist government would not observe his rights, that in spite of two acquitals, he would be pursued by Chavez as a favor to Fidel.illegals in the U.S., but to our Liberal press and members of the media, the only one of importance is Carriles. He is personally convicted in the news by Dick Morris, in spite of his acquital. Does Morris have some information not available to the public or to the courts in Venezuela?
Val, you're wasting time and energy on these cockroaches; there is nothing you can ever say or write which will change their minds. You are making inroads, and you are affecting people's opinions by bringing them a clearer view of what is going on in Cuba, that it is a terrorist regime and keeps the people in bondage to castro (La Grande Cucaracha), with block wardens to inform on every citizen in the country, thereby stifling opposition and inflicting a climate of fear among the genral population.
Never, never do they bring up the horrendous record of executions in Cuba, at least 15,000 according to the Black Book of Communism (p.664), or the torture cells in Cuba's Gulag for dissidents.
For years my constant complaint was that too much of the honest story about Cuba was being told in Spanish, to those who already knew it, but not enough in English. so that the American people could read and understand it! Agustin Blasquez was working on his films, but could not reach out to a wide enough audience, because the Liberals in the film colony worked to suppress his truths by ignoring his work. You reach out to a wider audience and people in your age bracket can understand you and reach out to you in return. If you simply ask your readers to recommend your Blogs to five to ten friends, you'll have a greater growth and effect. And, you are having an effect, even if it is only making the cockroaches angry! Keep it up.
The castro parrots continually bring up the fact that Americans cannot travel to Cuba, but never, never mention that Cubans are shot dead for trying to travel abroad, when they attempt to leave secretly because the government will not allow them to leave with legal passports! They ignore simple facts, such as that. How many Cubans, for example, were shot dead by Cuba's Coast Guard or Army or Air Force for "attempting to escape" an Island of government prisoners" by orders of either fidel or raul castro? Doesn't that qualify or identify them as Terrorists under International Law? He is not the President, the Prime Minister nor does he hold any legal office; he is a tyrannical dictator who holds power because he and his brother command the guns and tanks with which to defeat any opposition.
His U.S. supporters ignore all of these facts, and they forgive the thousands of executions, or the suppression of basic freedoms and human rights, simply ignore the inhuman conditions that go on and on and on in the prison system, the punishments accorded to dissidents, men and women who committed no violent crimes, simply disagreed with Cuban policies.
They ignore the thousands of casualties suffered by Cuban troops abroad, and the Cuban secret police taking over in Venezuela, but make the most imortant issue in the U.S. today - that of Carriles, a man suspected by Liberals, but as you point out...never convicted in any court of a crime. That is the information available to them, but studiously ignored...because he is an enemy of fidel (La Grande Cucaracha de Cuba), and anyone fidel hates, they automatically hate too.
Posted by: howarde at May 25, 2005 06:22 PM
mojoman:
nothing i have said has any support? well lets see, i said the far right cuban element has engaged in a failed appraoch, i have 46 years that says that is true.. i said batista was no better than castro, i think that is true, and my angle there is that castros atrocities are as horrible as those that occured before he was in power, yet very few speak of those.. i said that clown prince and princess of the far right ninoska and perez roura refuse to admit how perez rorua changed tunes when it suited him and nioskas father paco was a pretty mean guy who did things as nasty as the ones she accuses castros men of doing today.. here is another fact:for 46 years the cry has been "el proximo ano en cuba" yet it has not happened, mainly because of failed policies and "la misma cataleta" which has achieved nothing.. the points on perez roura and ninoska may be open for debate, but how can you say i have presented nothing? the mere fact that we are arguing over this is because cuba is not free, and it is not free because of a hard line stance that has not changed or caused change.. if those arent facts, what constitutes one?
FACT:castro is STILL in power after 46 years
FACT:for 46 years a hard line stance towards cuba has FAILED to bring about change
FACT:the far right cuban element has refused to budge from their positions
maybe its time to re-evaluate the approach..
FACT:for years the miami community has been all words, no action..
on the posada issue:
FACT: one mans terrorist is another nations freedom fighter
and you cant have it both ways, either posada DID NOT participate in any of these activities, and hes all talk, or he did, in which case he is a terrorist..
robert:
i dont have a solution, not even a bullet to the head will solve this, because after castro, there will be more of the same, and the in blood lust for repriseals, the message will get lost.. time has proven a NEW approach must be researched..
Posted by: daniel at May 25, 2005 06:32 PM
Daniel,
The hard-line approach could work if others joined in. The embargo doesn't work largely because the US is the only one playing. Of course, the attempt to defeat fidel by force was also tried, but that failed due to lack of proper support. The other alternative is to let fidel continue until he dies and then see what happens, that seems to be the approach that most non hard-liners adopt. What do we have left? What's the other approach?
One million Cubans in Miami and other places can't produce change by themselves. We need help. That's why many of the so-called Miami Mafia supported the Assembly to Promote Civil Society in Cuba this past weekend. The change has to start in Cuba. They deserve our support through words AND actions. From reading this blog and others I think you would agree that we've delivered on both counts.
That new approach you asked about? I think you might have stumbled onto it.
Posted by: Robert at May 25, 2005 06:41 PM
Val:
Interesting information regarding Posada Carriles' previous acquittals. That's one thing that I had not heard about, and it is certainly persuasive evidence that he has a better case than what is portrayed in the MSM (as if we should be surprised by that).
I'm afraid that you are technically incorrect on your double-jeopardy argument. The SCOTUS has repeatedly held that the constitutional protection against double-jeopardy only applies as to a single sovereign, and that nothing prevents multiple sovereigns from trying someone for the same charge. This even applies to federal/state sovereignty. Thus, someone who is acquitted of bank robbery in federal court can still be tried for the same bank robbery in state court.
I would agree with anybody who says that this is an awfully close reading of the double-jeopardy clause. But unfortunately, that is what the SCOTUS has held.
Posted by: SWLiP at May 25, 2005 06:56 PM
Those are fact yes but the fact that the Miami community has done nothing? First of all, you ignored the fact the US government forbade us from fighting for our country. That is a fact. This has nothing to do with hard line or soft line. The fact that we don't shut up though annoying to most is all that we could do.
Batista was a dictator and I am no fan of Batista if it wasn't for him we wouldn't be in this mess, but he wasn't as bad as fidel. castro does not compromise period; if he did we wouldn't be having this discussion. There is only one line his way or firing squad, it is impossible to negotiate with people like that. I would love to think that lifting the embargo would help Cuba, but if that were true the billions that the Soviets gave them and the 53,000 barrels a day of oil they get from Venezuela would help Cuba, yet Cuba continues to sink. You cannot have liberty without freedom of expression, association or the right to assembly, all of which are lacking in Cuba. The truth is that until he is dead there can never be any kind of negotiations
I do agree that when he dies if we go in with the notion of violent reprisals we will get nowhere and it will be more of the same. My point on Carriles is that he was acquitted and it must end there because that is the way it must be or none of us are safe. IF he is guilty he will get his one way or another, but the courts say he is not
Posted by: mojoman at May 25, 2005 07:13 PM
Val,
I don't know that much about Posada to weigh in on whether he should be extradited but I do know enough about Assata and the American “justice” system to know that any appeal would have a snow balls chance in hell of succeeding. I know that because Sundiata Acoli, who was the driver of the car, is still in prison and has recently been denied parole. Further I know of the COINTELPRO program that had targeted every black group in America and that the Black Liberation Army, to which Assata belonged to had been targeted.
I also know of the false information about Assata put forth in articles like the one above.
Posted by: Carl Muhammad at May 25, 2005 08:49 PM
Muhammad,
Let's just wait for cagastro's money to go a bit scarce. Your hero will sell that woman to the American government for whatever the price might be at that time.
Wait and see, or read what he has done with other African American activists in Cuba, who ultimately prefered the stiff conditions of an American jail to the liberties of a privileged foreigner in Cuba.
Ask them, not me.
Ask the Black Cubans how they feel about your hero. Look at his government cadre. No blacks. Look at the opposition photos, half of the people are black, the rest white. That should tell you something.
Oh, do not regard his liberal use of the N word to refer to blacks.
Posted by: Abajo Fidel at May 25, 2005 11:11 PM
Daniel, The old argument of batista or castro is tiring. Why does it have to be one or the other? That said, your statement that batista was as bad as castro is not true. Here, read and learn. http://www.cubanet.org/CNews/y98/feb98/16e5.htm
Posted by: Kathleen at May 25, 2005 11:29 PM
Katheleen, I am returning the compliment, to who deserves it the most: you are a treasure!
Posted by: CB at May 25, 2005 11:39 PM
CB, right back to you :) Thanks
Posted by: Kathleen at May 26, 2005 12:15 AM
This Posada argument is such an essay in idiotic pacifism it is laughable. Cubans are blamed for NOT trying to get rid of Castro. Let say Posada DID blow up the plane (charge which he TWICE beat) but let's say he DID.
I want ONE of the "Posada should be extradite crowd" to tell US how Fidel Castro got into power? Cause I don’t recall any elections but I DO recall a LOT of Bombs and civilian people blown to pieces by Castrists bombs in La Habana.
So how do you wage a war against Fidel Castro from outside Cuba? The same way the USA waged a war against Germany, you BOMB something and innocent people DO die cause that is WAR. This holier than though attitude of some of you just BAFFLES me. "Well we can NOT stoop to Castro's level” Oh No ? Then do tell us yee of pure souls how do we get rid of Castro?. Let's have a VOTE in the USA and if he looses he goes away ? Let us pray to Chango ?
Think THAT will work?
If indeed Posada blew up that plane it was an act of war against another terrorist and 72 of his sympathizers, what part of this is confusing to anyone ?
Yes since 9/11 we have become over sensitized to terrorism , but we still suffer it our decision is , we will NOT commit it , but the rest of the world really is not and has never played by our rules. No matter how many Hippy peacenik collars you wear my friend if someone hates your ass they will blow it to pieces.
I lived 9/11 10 blocks from ground zero and looking at THAT destruction all those people jumping to their death , a sound that I can assure you will NEVER forget my only thought was ( as the realist I am ) " well we got fucked .. so I guess a few million of them should be about to be turned to ashes in a few hours. " But we didn’t , we waited and we asked for public opinion and we debated and we issued strong notes of protest to the UN and we finally with kid gloves go into Afghanistan just with enough power to do a little damage , but try not to wake anyone up, cause that would be so rude!. I say BULLSHIT. I say that kind of thinking would have put a Heir something or other in the White House and we all would be goose-stepping to some grotesque Wagnerian opera. You hit I'll hit back twice as hard and in a flash. Fuck YOU and your family!
What did posada do (if indeed he did do it) that has not been done in every war that has ever been fought through history?
And this is OUR god damn problem Cubans , we want Castro out but we want to talk him out of office.. Let's play nice maybe he will play nice.
What do you peace loving anti-terrorist, violence is not the answer think the USA should’ve done after the brother's to the rescue massacre ?
Well TWO of the pilots were judged guilty of murder any of you advocate for an exchange? Cause I don’t see ANYONE fighting for the one man that may or may not have had the actual BALLS to do something against Castro. As always the pat answer is CAPITULATE give in to Castro, give Elian, give him Posada , hell give him the keys to the White House while you’re at it.
You people deserve the fate of the Spaniards , NO to terrorism ! yes, but convince ETA to stop blowing people up first.
Even the biggest Castro ass kisser in Miami Luis Ortega has said that this Posada thing is just a charade another Castro entertainment hour to keep Cubans from thinking how hungry they are and YOU.. YOU people fall for this shit.
Well you know what ?, if Posada is sent to Venezuela , I want Castro sent to the USA for having been found of killing over 150,000 Cubans , *I* charge him not only with terrorism but with Genocide. You grant me my wish and I will make sure you get yours.
and YES Mandela was a god damn terrorist and if you are such a naive idiot that has bought this 30 years of innocence in prison bullshit , your library card rights should be revoked because you have the reading comprehension level of a god damn Dinosaur.
Posted by: KillCastro at May 26, 2005 12:53 AM
KillCastro, I agree with you 100%. I keep hearing rumblings that Bush wants to go into Cuba. If only I pray. Yeah, I know it would be really messy. So? I say Cuba's taken enough shit and it needs to stop.
Posted by: Kathleen at May 26, 2005 01:13 AM
SAID LIKE A MAN
You're damn right, war is war is war. Castro gives no mercy, and he deserves none. While his henchmen in the U.S. preach passivism, he trains his schoolchildren in weaponry at an early age, and judging from the pictures, somewhere around 12. (Who can fill this in?)
While our schoolchildren are expelled for even thinking about what a gun looks like, the agressor nations are mobilizing their troops continuously. North Korea could march through the South in a few days and then, they'd begin the executions. North Vietnam kept the South Vietnamese army imprisoned for years, and more than 50,000 died (right, Janie baby?) in the prison camps. Japan slaughtered 300,000 Chinese in 90 days, 100,000 of them a whole Chinese Army that had surrendered to them, but apologists have literally disarmed America so drastically that we would have a tough time defending our coastline even if Cuba sent an invasion force across the Straits.
I've read the newspapers daily (except for five years at sea) since I was about 7, in 1931, up to three or four many days. I know what we've gone through and what other nations have gone through. I know about our immigrants, and can say that in all I've read, except for the late 1700s and early 1800s, the most successful and ambitious are those from Cuba. This is not to denigrate any others, because I lived among and worked with and hired many Mexicans and admire their work ethic tremendously.
Our schools are teaching children to be pansies, and seem to have a standard anti-war attitude. They preach peace through surrender, not maintaining your strength to let the enemy know that they'd better not screw around with you.
The Berkeley mantra has spread throughout the country; we have a bare majority right now and if we intend to keep this country free, we'd better reverse the trend in education and honor and praise our heroes, those who served and even died for this country, not the twits who carry signs up and down the street in San Francisco and Oakland.
The strongest country in the world can fall, like any other, if our men and women don't believe in serving in the military, in being also the best in what we do. Cubans know that. You don't really appreciate freedom until you've lost it. In Norway, where ordinary men and women constantly risked their lives in the Underground during the Nazi occupation, today's generation have forgotten that, and they'd fall under a bootheel again without a whimper. Cubans know the difference and as long as they keep such things in mind, they'll eventually dispose that murderous dictator, along with his henchmen.
Posted by: Howarde at May 26, 2005 04:06 AM
Right on Kathleen.
The embargo worked against South Africa, and the liberaloide media was right behind it, and celebrities, ain't going to play Sun City anyone.
I guess embargoes are OK as long as they are against right leanng dictatorships. No I am not defending Apartheid, but if the embargo against Cuba had been supported by the rest of the world like the one against South Africa, we would not be having this conversation!
Posted by: Pepon at May 26, 2005 07:14 AM
For all those who believe Cubans are all talk and no action when it comes to confronting kagastro, go to this Univision link and read the article by Enrique Encinosa. It is in Spanish:
http://www.univision.com/content/content.jhtml?cid=603997
For about 7 years, groups of brave Cuban men and WOMEN fought the good fight against impossible odds. Imagine what might have been the outcome if the liberal crowd had pushed hard to support them! But no, their fight was not "politically correct." At least in the eyes of the so-called "liberal" crowd.
Posted by: Alberto Quiroga at May 26, 2005 07:53 AM
robert
thanks for your reply.. look, maybe i need to clear something up, i AM NOT a "castro apologist", believe me, i think the guy is a scum bag, HOWEVER, i am NO FAN of the hard line miami mentality either.. while it has not been done to me here (yet), i have seen where anyone who does not subscribe to the hard line is instantly called "communista" or "rojo".. for far too long this issue has been dealt with in "absolutes" and many issues have been ignored.. i spend about 6-9 months outside of the states.. i have come in contact with many cubans (islanders), specifically, medical students and doctors in several south american countries, and let me tell you, id say they are 60 (dont like)-40 (like) when it comes to castro, but the majority do not have good opinions of the "miami" cubans.. and before we use the "castro has poisoned the minds argument, let me say that even those that vehemently oppose castro, do NOT like the miami faction.. they feel that they are trying to line themselves up for a post catro cuba, and resent the fact that (and this is how many i have spoken to feel) those who left the country during the bad times want to return when it is rosy..
Posted by: daniel at May 26, 2005 09:04 AM
Daniel:
They think that way because that is what has been fed to them for 46 years. castro has told the that WWII started when we dropped the H bombs in Japan. Imagine what else he sasys about us. So in you contact with them please let them know that this is not true. You have a rare oportunity to bridge that gap, that would be doing something.
Posted by: mojoman at May 26, 2005 09:42 AM
Daniel,
First, I think you need to be careful when making generalizations about the Miami exile community. While its true, there are some that may be planning their returns when things are "rosy" as you said the majority, for example, like my parents, will never return to Cuba. Their interests lie not solely on seeing fidel castro gone, but seeing their country or origin have a future.
I cannot speak for those Cubans (islanders) you have met that have a negative opinion of Miami cubans, but I can say that without the billion dollars or so a year that these evil Miami exiles send to their families still on the island, those islanders lives would be much much more difficult. When you speak to Cubans from the island you need to keep in mind that they have not only endured the direst of circumstances, but have had the hatred for the gusanos instilled in them from childhood. They live in a country without a free press and without dissenting opinions, thus this negative opinion of miami exiles you speak of is inherent.
Of course, the argument is neither here nor there, as the rafts only head one way, and those evil miami exiles are the ones that take them in and offer jobs, housing, support - regardless of differing opinions vis-a-vis the embargo and travel restrictions.
You speak of being wary of absolutes while speaking in absolutes.
On Saturday, I typed up an email to fidel for an older lady, she was about mid seventies. When I finished typing her note to fidel I asked her if she wanted to sign it. "No," she said, while her eyes were screaming "yes."
"Es que ya tengo visa y voy a Cuba en Noviembre," she said.
Now, I am a firm beleiver in the embargo and the travel restrictions (thats a topic for another day), but I looked at her with a stunned look on my face when she said that.
She patted me on the shoulder softly and said "No te preocupes, mijo. Es que tengo a mis padres alla todavia."
I broke down and cried because that is the epitomy of being cuban. Es un lamento. Un lamento que esa senora tenga que sentirse mal por viajar a su patria y que yo tenga que sentirme mal por que ella tenga que viajar a su patria. El ser cubano es un lamento, daniel. Any way you look at it.
Everyone speaks being able to travel to see their families on the isalnd, yet everyone forgets how much more beautiful it would be if our families could travel here to see us and to experience this country first hand.
And one quick thing about the embargo. You speak in absolutes there as well when you say it has not worked. Perhaps youre right, of course, because fidel castro is still there. But imagine what his regime would be had he had control over the millions and millions of dollars entering the island because of no embargo. In a country where they arrest you for trading a chicken, where tourism is run by the ministry of defense, where no cubans are allowed to own business, where peddlers are arrested simply for selling an orange, where famrmers are cited and arrested for grwoing extra crops for their families, who do you think would benefit most from the lifting of the embargo?
Posted by: Val Prieto at May 26, 2005 09:46 AM
KillCastro:
Your right, and we should have started in Afghanistan and ended up with Saudi Arabia.
But none of that will ever happen, because of all of the chichi liberal bullshit. You know the, “Useful idiots” that think he is misunderstood and bash our country because they feel guilty for being a have rather than a have not. We can't get them to pick a judge for God's sake. You think we will ever attack their poster boy fidel? Should it happen? Of course, it should have happened the day after the Soviet Union collapsed, so if we didn't do it then, it aint happening now. Fact is my friend its up to us. This is one way. How?
I have some ideas. What do you think?
Posted by: mojoman at May 26, 2005 10:54 AM
Maybe you missed one thing i mentioned: some of these cubans i have met that have a negative view on the miami cubans ALSO have a negative view of castro.. they have the independence to dislike castro, but not the independence to dislike the miami cubans?? they have a strong disdain for the hardline taken by the ninoska-perez-roura types.. they are afraid of what happens after, that some will try to step in after 46 years and say "all's well that ends well" and act like nothing happened in the interim.. they always ask "who are YOU in miami to tell US how to act" its very easy for those outside of cuba to thump their chests and take the hard line while those in cuba suffer.. you speak of the dollars sent, but how many are willing to admit it in CERTAIN circles? you cant send dolars, cant listen to certain musicians, cant read huber matos book, cant travel to visit your family, cant do this that or the other because the slightest connection to the castro regime has you branded a "communista".. you know, one of the proudest moments, that made me feel truly cuban was in brasil, and i saw los orishas perform live twice, once in sao paulo, and once in rio.. and i was right up front, with a cuban soccer jersey and a cuban flag.. and the smiles, the looks in the eyes of those guys when they started performing and saw "otro cubano" right up front was amazing.. i got to speak to them later on, and they seem to be nice down to earth guys.. now, i tell this story at versailles, and id be lucky to get out of there alive.. and let me say, when you speak to them and they know what they say isnt going to be transmitted, lets just say youd have a different opinion than most have right now.. but they have that same opinion of many cubans outside of miami have, that this faction is to extreme to be able to proceed in the right direction..
Posted by: daniel at May 26, 2005 11:13 AM
Daniel,
Maybe you missed one thing i mentioned: some of these cubans i have met that have a negative view on the miami cubans ALSO have a negative view of castro.. they have the independence to dislike castro, but not the independence to dislike the miami cubans??
Where in my comment does it state that Cubans shouldnt have any independence to dislike whomever they wish? hell, after enduring 46 years of fidel castros propaganda machinations, i would be surprised if they DIDNT hate miami cubans. We are all, as you so proudly seem to expound, extreme radical hard liners intent on making their lioves miserable and getting our beach cabanas back.
Por favor, man.
they have a strong disdain for the hardline taken by the ninoska-perez-roura types.. they are afraid of what happens after, that some will try to step in after 46 years and say "all's well that ends well" and act like nothing happened in the interim.. they always ask "who are YOU in miami to tell US how to act" its very easy for those outside of cuba to thump their chests and take the hard line while those in cuba suffer..
More absolutes from the one person in this thread that stated he's tired of hearing about absolutes.
I can assure you, daniel, those hard liners you so abhor are all resigned to the fact that there will never be an "all well that ends well."
You act as if we maimi cubans control the whole shindig. We dont. Get a grip. There's only one guy in charge and his name is fidel castro. And it is obviously only us miami cubans that really give a shit about removing him from power, with the exception of those cubans in the island who unfortunately are so regulated and oppressed that they cant do a damn thing about it from there.
It is you that is in the minotity, daniel. In the two years I have been blogging here I have recieved hundreds and hundreds of emails expressing support from cubans exiled ALL OVER THE WORLD. from Iceland to slovania to the czech republic to austrailia to costa rica and every where else in between. All of them expressing the sadly undeniable fact that lifting the embargo will not cure the disease, just ease the symptoms. The cancer will still be there, only growing more rapidly.
I am not thumping my chest, daniel, I am fighting for what is just and right. I can do that, you see, because I am free to do so. As are you.
I urge you to read every single post on this blog and find one entry or article where I denigrate, as you are doing here, a fellow cuban american because he or she has a differing opinion than mine. Find one, i challenge to look for it. Youll be hard pressed, becuase no matter how naive I believe your opinions to be, I have to believe that we both want the same thing: freedom for cuba.
you speak of the dollars sent, but how many are willing to admit it in CERTAIN circles? you cant send dolars, cant listen to certain musicians, cant read huber matos book, cant travel to visit your family, cant do this that or the other because the slightest connection to the castro regime has you branded a "communista".
You obviously failed to read my previous comment to you regarding this "certain circles" thing you keep whining about. Did you see me condemn that woman for travelling to cuba? Did I berate her in any way? Did I call her out as a communist sympathiser in front of all at the convention floor? Did I tell her that visiting her parents in Cuba was wrong? DID I?
The only person doing the condeming here is you, daniel. You show a lack of tolerance while criticizing what you deem to be a lack of tolerance. And in those nasty absolutes you keep whiningg about.
Thi swhole "I hate fidel castro as much as the next guy but" thing followed by an attack AGAINST YOUR OWN - because whether you agree with us or not, we are you own - is really pathetic and disturbing, and is exactly what that guy with the beard you hate so much wants.
Ive read every single comment you have posted here whining about needing a different approach, yet you havent offered one up. At least, not one with any viable thought to its repercussions.
So lets just agree to disagree agreebly and you go and do what you think is right while I do what i think is right.
But I will tell you one thing though, I will not allow you to bad mouth my community anymore. there may be some elements to it that may not be perfect, but your sweeping generalizations are completely off the mark.
Posted by: Val Prieto at May 26, 2005 12:01 PM


